Created by and for people with physical disabilities.

Code of Conduct

Apr 01, 1998

This is an archival transcript of one of our past meetings. We don't have scheduled topical meetings anymore, but we're not opposed to the idea of bringing them back if someone is willing to commit to hosting them on a "long term" basis.

Participants already present:
  HelloKit ([email protected])
  jrt ([email protected])
  Mooooooo ([email protected])
HelloKit: logging is on
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HelloKit: Well, it's a small crowd... I was afraid of that since I wasn't able to send a reminder.
Mooooooo: the list will be up soon
Mooooooo: the hard drive crashed
HelloKit: ah... were they able to salvage it or do I get to start over again?
Mooooooo: no idea
HelloKit: k
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HelloKit: Should I wait a few minutes or go ahead and start?
Mooooooo: lots of people wrote and asked why we kicked them off the list
jrt: Hi Jo:)
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Mooooooo: wait a few
Mooooooo: ho jo
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HelloKit: k
Mooooooo: wb jo
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Jo: Hello Mooooooo darling!
Jo: Hi Carly, jrt, Amazin1, Kali and MrLinux
HelloKit: Heya Jo :o)
Mooooooo: whats new?
Amazin1: Jo :)
Mooooooo: how many are on the list now?
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HelloKit: Just over 100
Mooooooo: hi john
HelloKit: Hey John
Mooooooo: wow
CincyKid: Evening to you DAn, Kit
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HelloKit: Hi Jan
erdy: Hi Carly
CincyKid: Wow, what a topic, good one
jrt: Hi cincykid:)
jrt: ]Hi erdy:)
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erdy: hi jrt
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Jettin: hi everyone
HelloKit: Hey Jettin
erdy: hi
* HelloKit feels like a Wal-Mart people greeter :o)
Jettin: hi kit, erdy
erdy: where's the shopping cart
HelloKit: hehe
erdy: hi jettin
jrt: Hi jettin:)
Jettin: hi jrt. Hows everyone doin tonight
Mooooooo: im great :o)
jrt: great:)
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Jettin: hi Moooooooooo
Mooooooo: are you 70 years old carly?
Jo: Fun on the computer tonight. Keep getting disconnected.
HelloKit: I'm having what I hope is the worst week of the year, but other than that I'm great :o)
Jo: Awwwwww : - )
Jettin: Wel, I hope it gets better for you kit
Mooooooo: ok we can start
HelloKit: okie dokie
HelloKit: Well guys, I wrote a corny little speech to start of tonight's meeting... bear with me. :o)
HelloKit: off
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CincyKid: This oughta be good. :-)
Mooooooo: hi rosie
rosie_: hi moo
HelloKit: When we first started #Disabled, we tried to keep the amount of written rules to a minimum. We wanted it to be a casual environment where people would feel comfortable, and we thought we could trust people to act in a responsible and mature manner.
jrt: wb rosie:)
HelloKit: Lately though, it hasn't been working. The unwritten rules of respect and common courtesy have failed. People who have been banned for outrageous and rude behavior argue that they have a right to do whatever they please and should not be banned for any reason.
HelloKit: So I have decided to establish a clear set of rules which will hopefully help to protect us from these attacks, or at least to give us a clear justification for removing the 'undesirables' from the channel. And I want to have everyone's input, opinions and ideas for establishing these rules.
Kali: ib
HelloKit: Now I want you all to know that none of you are part of the problems we're having, but I hope you can help us and be part of the solution.
jrt: ping me
rosie_: 15 secs here jrt
HelloKit: So now it's your turn to talk... ;o)
HelloKit: 16 secs Debbie
Mooooooo: well....
Mooooooo: actual rules are kind of hard to lay out...
MrLinux: yes they r
Mooooooo: for the reason that what the idea of misconduct is varies
Mooooooo: example...
jrt: but some guide lines would be okay:)
Mooooooo: someone uses a 'cuss word' in a conversation...
Mooooooo: thats not necessarly bad
Mooooooo: but someone who enters doing the same could be considered bad
Mooooooo: abuse is one of those 'i know it when i see it' things
jrt: yeah thats true, depends on what context they are in
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Mooooooo: yeah, context is very important
CincyKid: That would also depend on whether minors were present
jrt: true
Mooooooo: yep, many things have to be considered
CincyKid: Conduct should be the consensus of the room maybe, if you know what i mean
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Mooooooo: sometimes i jump the gun too
jrt: yes and respect as well, like some people have different beliefs etc than others
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Mooooooo: i banned someone yesterday because his nick was 'offensive' and his first words were not 100% polite
Jo: yes certain deeply religious people have to bend a little bit. We aren't here to prosletize.
CincyKid: I think we all agree that someone who is being derogatory or verbally abusive of someone , should be kicked or banned
jrt: but iys hard when that happens, do you let them stay and upset somebody or do you kick them before that might happen??
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erdy: it's rudeness...and when they're insulting to others
Jo: You have to wait until they do wrong. They can't be kicked immediately unless they have proven to be vulgar and argumentative all the time.
jrt: yeah, youcant judge a book by its cover in this instance
Mooooooo: this person fit all the classic signatures of a trouble maker
HelloKit: I think the most important thing is going to be that we make it clear that the ops (and anyone with ban power) have a right to decide what is and isn't acceptable and to act accordingly.
Jo: Yes ops is the supreme commander of disabled.
jrt: yes and also let it be know that just because we are called disabled, we are not here for all the wierdos to pipck on
jrt: known
CincyKid: That's what ops are for, isn't it?
jrt: pick
Jo: And for the teenagers to take over our channel and turn it into 'love me' time
jrt: yeah but its hard, because the irc is open to every wierd and wondrful person out there, its a job trying to weed the good from the bad
Jo: If I have to sit through two hours of ahhhh, eee, oooh, uuuuh, yummmmm again I will puke.
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jrt: so will I Jo,lol
Mooooooo: lol
Mooooooo: hi jeff
Pyro: hi
Jo: hi pyro
jrt: Hi pryo:)
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Mooooooo: ok Jo, me and carly will try to keep our affair to a bare minimum
Mooooooo: hi rose
jrt: how do the other family oriented channels police and cope with this??
CincyKid: lol
Jo: That is abuse of the channel and very upsetting to disabled who have attendants tune us in so they can watch.
rose: hi all
HelloKit: Jo: Like, 'Users who deliberately interrupt organized discussions (i.e. Wednesday meetings) will be temporarily banned until the discussion is over.'
jrt: Hi rose:)
Jo: Oh darling you are cheating on me. boop hoo
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Mooooooo: i wont kick, but maybe go to moderated
Jo: Yes kit. The night I ran meeting it took me over 10 minutes to get them to stop horsing around. Once meeting is called to order they should knock it off.
Lily: it's hard to be ops, and you just have to make a quick judgement sometimes
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Mooooooo: we did that a couple meetings ago and it worked well
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HelloKit: Okay, that's another idea I had. During meetings we can go to moderated, and give everyone a voice... and just de-voice as needed.
jrt: like I try and be very understanding, but sometimes its hard
Jo: Not sure how you do that but sounds ok.
turbokev: sounds hard kit
Jo: We are in middle of serious discussion and someone starts chatting with another, let them take it elsewhere.
jrt: yeah I remember we did that once, and it seemed to work
HelloKit: Not really, Kevin.
HelloKit: right
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erdy: sounds like a surgical procedure
Jo: Kit one night they were so rude to you, even doing roses and stuff. That is not right.
turbokev: What is todays topic?
Mooooooo: t916yv
jrt: you dont feel a thing erdy:)
Mooooooo: s03s
Mooooooo: oops
erdy: whew
Jo: : - )
HelloKit: look up
jrt: Daniel, what language are you talking in!!
Mooooooo: random keys
Lily: lol
jrt: touch typing for the blind,lol
Jo: I have tried to take back the channel a few times now. Some people think I am a mean old lady cause they didn't understand what I was doing.
HelloKit: er, never mind... my topic is gone lol
Lily: i thought this was it
Jo: A 13 year old non disabled person on here demanding attention and trying to pick up guys all the time is not right.
jrt: I know how you feel Jo, I do it sometimes too
jrt: no way
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Mooooooo: well, in the last few days a lot of the people causing the trouble have either disappeared or were flushed
jrt: Hi ket:)
kettt: ;) hi
Mooooooo: after my post to the list
Jo: Many who come on here and want to ask questions about meds or cathing etc. don't want to say anything because they are on here.
jrt: yeah its been really nice the last few days:)
Lily: i haven't noticed it very often, not lately
Jo: Big difference and a lot of the old regulars are coming back since you cleaned house.
Mooooooo: the one thing that does need to be pointed out though...
jrt: yes Daniel I've even noticed that:)
Jo: I almost quit the channel because I was so upset over it, then decided heck no this is OUR channel and we should take it back over.
Jo: what Mooooooooo?
turbokev: Thats right Jo
Mooooooo: the common bond of this group is that most of us have a disability, but that was never intended to be the forced theme of the channel. We are all different and have many interests
jrt: I agree too Jo
Mooooooo: the topics will vary
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turbokev: The house needed cleaned up
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Mooooooo: as well as the age and maturity levels
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turbokev: what happened?
HelloKit: Argh! It's a good thing the bots are logging, cuz I can't stay connected long enough to get anything...
Jo: yes and that makes it very hard to do programs. But you have variety so everyone has a day in here and must learn to share.
Mooooooo: the problems of the last few weeks were caused because everyone put too much focus on disabilities
jrt: yes, but when all these sickos and whoever see that this channel is called disabled, the friendliest channel..
Mooooooo: all the complaining was specificly related to disabilities
jrt: they know the people in here will be offended by them
Mooooooo: was too much complaining and not enough living
jrt: thats true daniel
Jo: We have to get out in our communities and educate people that disabled does not mean 'OK lets pick on the retard time.'
jrt: exactely Jo
Mooooooo: the reason I come here has nothing to do with disabilities
Mooooooo: i just like the people
Jo: ADA and other programs can only work if we are out and about and educate people that we have feelings to.
jrt: same here:)
Mooooooo: and when we focus too much on one thing, it gets real boring
Lily: very introspective, your right
turbokev: I haven't visited the scheduled chat lately because of my classes so I don't know the whole story but it sounds bad
jrt: and then all the hassels start
jrt: like every sicko out there now knows that this is where all the 'disabled' hang out
Jo: ok but we are still her to answer questions and help each other.
Mooooooo: actually debbie, i found out something very strange
jrt: yeah for sure Jo
jrt: whats that Daniel??
Mooooooo: ive have talked to a lot of the people who have come in here to harrass
Mooooooo: and most didnt really think the channel was real
Mooooooo: about disabilities
Mooooooo: they thought it was just a name
turbokev: We have to learn how to come to terms with our disabilities and learn how to live
jrt: I understand what you mean daniel
Jo: and if we ever hope to be accepted we have to educate people on what disabled is.
Mooooooo: thats not my calling
Jo: and have fun.
Mooooooo: im just me and if they have a problem, they can deal with it
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Jettin: I agree Moooooooooooo
turbokev: life to its fullest and ignore the ignorance of the few uneducated
jrt: I'm a bit like that too Daniel, they can take me for who I am or butt out
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Jo: I am a !@#!@ Yankee transplant, they gotta take me I won't go back to snow and ice.
turbokev: your right daniel and jrt
Lily: that's what makes it interesting, everyone is different
turbokev: say what Jo?
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Jo: and insecure people are afraid of different.
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Mooooooo: i explain myself to people who ask, but i dont want to waste my life educating the masses
jrt: lol,Jo
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jrt: exactely Daniel
Jo: turbo I happen to be a brass bottom, loud mouth old Yankee transplant who just happens to be disabled to. Around here both are disabilities.
Lily: lol
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HelloKit: The biggest problem in this channel lately isn't those random harrassers though - we're used to that and can handle them easily. The big problem is some of the newer members who think they own the universe or that we somehow owe them something.
turbokev: we might be disabled for a reason that god had in mind
Jo: In what way Kit?
turbokev: ie to educate
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usn21: hi gang
HelloKit: Without naming names, someone was here the other night who insisted on engaging in a particular behavior which annoyed several other users.
jrt: the problem is turbe is you can only educate those who want it
Mooooooo: This may sound calous, but the world doesn't owe us anything. At best, we owe them something because we are the ones forcing them to make changes for our benefit
turbokev: If I seem that way kit I don't intend to
jrt: turbo
HelloKit: When asked to stop, this person refused and became more and more angry and persistent, until he was eventually banned and then turned around and accused us of violating his right to free speech.
Jo: We have one I feel sorry for but you can't force people to talk to you if they don't want to.
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HelloKit: He actually told us we were breaking the law by banning him from the channel.
Jo: read that multiple personality letter.
HelloKit: So anyway, that incident is actually what inspired this meeting.
Jo: You don't have to tolerate someone coming in here and making believe they are other people to get attention.
jrt: no the world owes us nothing, but,the changes they make are sometimes not just for the benifits of disabled people
turbokev: you can educate people by just being out in public
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Jo: Carly it all boils down to your house, your rules. You don't have to post them you can refuse entry to anyone you want or throw out anyone you don't want.
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HelloKit: I want to make sure that it is clear that we have rules and the right to ban anyone with or without a reason.
jrt: thats true Jo, all these other channels do it, why not us as well
CincyKid: without reason?
jrt: but when you jion a server isnt that whats scrolled doen in front of people
Jo: I understand now. Didn't know Moooooo could see things I didn't so was confused other day. Now I won't ever question him again.
jrt: join
HelloKit: Not that we would ban without reason, but the point is that we do have that right.
jrt: like no harrassing, flooding, swearing, ect
Lily: what's flooding?
CincyKid: I know, I agree, but it just didn't sound right.
Jo: aggrevating, instigating and trying to get people to come meet you for sex on here.
HelloKit: Yes but most don't read that, and like this guy the other night, he says those rules are illegal to even have (which we all know is BS).
Mooooooo: i wont enforce a no swearing rule
jrt: I think it is like saying the same thing line after line
turbokev: Kit, in my opinion, free speech doesn't include harrassment so that bozo is most likely out of line for insenuateing that harrassing is part of the 1st amendment
Mooooooo: the prime rule is 'don't be a jerk'
CincyKid: How about offensive nicks?
Jo: Bingo Moooooooo
jrt: right on Mooooooo
HelloKit: If asked to change it and they refuse, then I would ban, yes.
Mooooooo: when someone uses an offensive nick, they are usually trying to be offensive
Mooooooo: the bots will auto-kick anyone with truly offensive nicks
CincyKid: sounds good to me, I'll vote for that
jrt: well I must admit, when I see an offensive nic, my warning signs are up straight away
turbokev: so many people either misinterpret or stretch the US Constitution
HelloKit: Personally, I wait until they actually do something.
jrt: I wait but I always just become wary of the nic
HelloKit: It doesn't matter what the constitution says... this is our channel, private property, and we have every right to impose extra rules.
jrt: thats okay turbo, I dont know the constitution for America
Jo: 0k
Lily: neither do I
Jo: I am for that. Sorry my 0 is broken : - )
Mooooooo: oh yeah, rule #2. No using 0 for o ;oP
Jo: I knew that would get you
HelloKit: I'm sorry if I sound like a b*tch guys, but this guy had me pretty ticked off.
Jettin: It come down to one thing, treat people with the respect you yourself want to be treated with. If they can't do that, then they deserve to be (kicked or banned).
jrt: you dont sound like a B*tch
Jo: Was there, saw it and wanted to strangle him myself.
Lily: missed it as usual
Jo: Honestly I think I would have banned very early on.
HelloKit: Especially since he threw such a fit when all he had to do was turn of his friggin' caps lock.
Jo: He did it deliberately to aggevate. Got his kicks getting attention and arguing
HelloKit: Aaaargh! Why do I keep typing 'of' instead of 'off'?
Mooooooo: its okay carly, even if you were a b*tch (and you're not), you're OUR b*tch :o)
HelloKit: lol
turbokev: I didn't say that the constition was not in this channels corner but I said that that guy was out of bounds
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Jo: Dear Abby said no one can use you unless you let them. So bounce them sooner and don't get so upset. No one on here comes here to put up with idiots like that.
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Jettin: exactly Jo
turbokev: sometimes we need a b**ch to keep things straight
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Mooooooo: i think i'll make a new bot called Exorcist to purge the bad people
jrt_1: sorry bout that:)
Lily: lol
HelloKit: lol
turbokev: but carly is too sweet to be one
Lily: what are you doing jrt?
jrt_1: getting disconnected:(
Jo: Most on here try so hard to be nice, bend over backward to please. But we all have to stand up to idiots.
Lily: :(
Jo: I had that when I first came on.
turbokev: so moooo is resulting to cyber terorism?
CincyKid: Wish I could stay longer, but it's time to go here...
turbokev: lol
Jo: by cincy
jrt_1: yeah I get it sometimes late at night when I come on
CincyKid: goodnight to all of ya
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Lily: well, when you first join, it's hard to know
jrt_1: night cincy
Jo: We can't dump it all on the ops to protect us we got to stand up and support them
jrt_1: yeah well I try as much as I can:)
Lily: my first time on, i was astonished by what some jerk said
Mooooooo: what did he say?
Lily: but wasn't sure how, or if it was my place, to respond
turbokev: when you're new you don't know people so you try hard to meet them
jrt_1: like I try and warn people if they start that what we do and dont tollerate, sometimes it works
Jo: A lot of people use the anonymity to act out things they would never do or say in person.
turbokev: in the group
Lily: you kicked him, moo, for a rude question about anmputees
Mooooooo: oh that guy
HelloKit: brb
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Jo: You meet them on the street and they are Mr. religious and and soooo good then in here they play super sex fiend.
jrt_1: I always try and approach new nics with friendliness, if they start well then I turn
Lily: yes, and i wasn't sure what to do
Mooooooo: lily, i banned his entire service provider from irc for 3 days
Jo: Once in a while I think I am on Fantasy Island and keep looking for Ricardo Montabalm and de plane to get shouted.
jrt_1: its ahrd Lily I know, I havent been on here that long about 7 months I think
Lily: good for you
Lily: takes a bit of getting used to
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turbokev: jo even if they don't do it in real life and they do it online then they still would do it
Mooooooo: mimi :o)
Mimi: hi guys :o)
jrt_1: Hi Mimi:)
kettt: Mimi..;)
Lily: brb
Jettin: hi mimi
Mimi: how is everyone?
Jo: jrt ferret just cmae in and says I got to tell you he is watching a program about Queensland and the Northern territories. : - )
Mooooooo: If anyone has a problem with being harrassed by any user, let me know
Mooooooo: im great :o)
Mimi: good :o)
Jettin: fin, and yourself Mimi?
turbokev: cyber and real life are the same if you are chatting
turbokev: hi mimi
Mimi: I'm tired but good, thanks :o)
kettt: hi Mimi...are you there in vegas?
jrt_1: tell him to look out for brisbane or the gold coast Jo:)
Jo: I keep a rolex with nicks and info on age and disability, children, siblings, etc. It helps so I understand the youngest ones are just being their age not acting up.
Mimi: yup, I'm here :o)
Jo: He is on York river with the crocs.
jrt_1: right:)
turbokev: r u from england jo
Jo: nope Texas
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Jo: born Massachusetts, Yankee transplant.
jrt_1: in the middle of no where,lol
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Jo: Yup jrt West Texas, miles from anything.
turbokev: what did quensland come from
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Mimi: that's a great idea Jo...I'm not that energetic or organized though
turbokev: near san antonio
Jo: Mooooooo anyone who comes in has to understand they are a guest in here and must observe rules and manners or leave.
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HelloKit: Does anyone have anything else to add to a list of possible rules?
Jo: further west by 200 miles.
Mooooooo: i think we have it covered
Mimi: I'm sorry I missed the meeeting everyone...I'm in a different time zone and got screwed up :o(
Jo: Put you are a guest here, this is my home and I can eject you anytime I want.
Lily: back now
turbokev: stay on topic (good rule)
jrt_1: I agree with jo, rules and manners or leave, treat others as you want to be treated
Jo: excuses, excuses, We all know you were at that roulette wheel again.
turbokev: jo good one
turbokev: i have to go
Lily: stay on topic is a good rule
Jo: Lots of them don't understand technical lingo but they will understand that.
turbokev: bye everyone
jrt_1: lol,Jo
Jo: bye
Mooooooo: bye kev
turbokev: adios
jrt_1: bye turbo:)
Jettin: bye all, see you people later
Mooooooo: see ya jettin
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Lily: i find it disconserting when i have to wade thro all the red herrings
jrt_1: bye jettin:)
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Jo: Ferret like some in here demands attention and won't go away. Gotta go. This is his night off. bye
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jrt_1: bye jo:)
Mooooooo: bye Jo
Mimi: we only have a 'topic' on Wednesday nights
Jo: Only one in 10 days and for 12 more. ': - )
Jo: bye
Jo: sorry
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Mooooooo: i think we did good
Lily: i think a more formal format is ok for wed. nights, i expected it
jrt_1: yeah I think we got the point across:)